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February 13, 2011
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Lounging Anne by cluedog Lounging Anne by cluedog
Lately, I've been working on another version (what was to be the final version) of the comic "Miss Doomsday". The image above was to be the second panel of page 2 (for the previous version, go here: [link] ). While this version is sexier and I really like the pose, the rest of the page just didn't cut it for me. Furthermore, I looked back at the earlier version and I really liked a lot of what I saw there. It isn't perfect but a lot of comic art isn't.

I'd been studying Wil Eisner's "The Spirit" and have been admiring the hell out of his artwork. However, I noticed that there were some strange anatomical anomalies in his work, incongruities in his backgrounds, and several other flaws. While I'm not in the same league as Mr. Eisner, I find I have perfectionist tendencies and, if something's not perfect, I scrap the whole thing.

I've just been thinking of going with the original version of "Miss Doomsday" seen here: [link] She's not as beautiful as the Anne above or in the new version of page 1 but a guy can go nuts drawing the same comic over and over.

Anyhoo, I'm just in my usual big ball of confusion, I suppose. I often find myself torn and tugged in various directions, artistically.

Any thoughts or comments would be greatly appreciated. :)
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:iconzeogold:
zeogold Featured By Owner Mar 31, 2011   Traditional Artist
she looks friendly
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:iconcockyvonmurdrtitsiii:
this is actually scary cause it looks way to much like me XD
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:iconsobes81:
Sobes81 Featured By Owner Feb 16, 2011
and btw I really love the panel just as a picture. I think it is a greatly composed portrait of a character, something I would love to achieve in photography but haven't so far. All those details in the pic (pizza, posters, bra, headphones, ipod and especially the cat) help for characterisation (she definitely loves music, has a cool and strong attitude, used big and decent headphones, seems to be quite relaxed about herself halfnaked etc) and are great to look at. And I just love Anne's chilled attitude on that one, and her pose, and the cigarette smoke, and the play with sexiness/nudity here and the ashtray (she smokes a lot doesn't she? One of those buds is still smoking too ;) and and and. Could be a poster, should be a poster :love: Two thumbs up!
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:iconsobes81:
Sobes81 Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011
IMHO: Greatest Anne so far. Nice expression, realistic figure (breasts seem to have weight and a nice size but are not too big and fit perfectly to the rest of the figure which is nicely feminine with real thighs etc), prettier than the old one but not too cute. I like that one.
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:iconmartgritte:
Martgritte Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Great picture, the little details say a lot about Anne's character.
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:iconcockyvonmurdrtitsiii:
wow that looks like a night in my house XD :heart:
love it!
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:iconkloob:
Kloob Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011  Professional General Artist
It's a great panel. I like this and the original equally. I also think that the very best work has flaws in it. The flaws are where the personality of the artist really creeps in and makes it distinct and different. That's just my take on it but if something's too perfect I find that slightly less interesting, hence Eisner is endlessly fascinating to me.
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:iconleviadragon99:
leviadragon99 Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
Poor kitty being her ashtray-holder... ah well, still a very nice shot of her in repose.
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:iconimortalnothingness:
imortalnothingness Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011   General Artist
baaaaaaaaaaaaaw, KITTY!!!!

OuO
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:icondiegotripodi:
DiegoTripodi Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
I think this panel looks great, Zac. Maybe this isn't a good option if you want to have an original of the actual comic page, but sometimes, when I have panels that I like in a page, and others that aren't good and need to be redrawn, I arrange the page in photoshop, using the parts that I liked, and pasting the new artwork in the computer (if I can paste a drawing in the original page, I don't mind doing that as well). Again, with the computer arrangement one doesn't have an original page, but separated drawings, but it can be a great shortcut.

About Eisner (big fan), I think that studying a lot of awesome artists, one notices that there are certain flaws in their drawings, that don't come accross when one first gets into these people's work, but they don't really affect a reader's experience (unless there are serious mistakes...). That said, those flaws, I don't really know if calling them like that. A lot of artwork is just not "academically correct", but I think of a guy like Jack Kirby, for example, that would draw anatomy that doesn't really exist, but the work looked so strong, and much more charming than the work of other guys that would draw accurate anatomy... but I guess that's a matter of taste, and some readers want everything to be drawn as it would be in real life, while others don't mind as long as the artwork does a good storytelling job. :)
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Thank you so much, Diego. I seriously am torn between the two versions of the comic, the new one and the previous one. Your suggestion is a great one, which I used in the full second page of the comic I just posted. I inserted the lips from the previous version of page 2 into the newest one.

As for your analysis of Eisner and Kirby's work, I think you're absolutely correct. I've always been afraid my flaws have been serious ones, sinking entire comic pages or drawings that I've done. Eisner's genius was the expressiveness of his characters and his storytelling. The man's stories seriously pull you in, a hallmark of a master storyteller.

Both versions of "Miss Doomsday" that I've done (both the 7 pages of the previous version and the two that I've done so far of the newer version) are not perfect but I'm trying to get myself to move forward with the comic, rather than going in circles. If I do go with the newer version (and I find myself bouncing back between both versions), it will have to be the final version, imperfect as it may be.

If Jack Kirby worked like I do with all my indecision, he never would have finished Fantastic Four #1, let alone the large volume of work he later produced. :)
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:icondiegotripodi:
DiegoTripodi Featured By Owner Feb 15, 2011
I don't feel at all, when reading your comics, that the flaws that you may have in your drawings affect your comic pages. Especially in your "Opey" series, which is the work of yours that I'm most familiar with, you totally manage to put the reader in the situation from the very beginning, and manage to keep the interest high through the whole page, so that if there are drawing mistakes, personally, I don't even stop to consider them since I'm more curious about what happens next in the story than in making sure if a hand is anatomically correct, or whatever... In regards of that, many times I have felt that each Opey page kind of works as a little episode that makes you want to read the following page. If that isn't what makes for great storytelling, then I don't know. :)
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 19, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Wow. Thanks, Diego. I deeply, deeply appreciate your comment. I'm working on redrawing the seven previous pages of "Miss Doomsday" (I've already completed two of them and I've still got the other five to go), after which I'll decide which version I'll go with (the new version or the older one). Then, I'm going to alternate between drawing a page of "Opey the Warhead" and "Miss Doomsday". One week, I'll draw a page of Doomsday and then, the next week, a page of Opey. In roughly two months, there will be a new page of Opey, as I'll be starting up the comic again. The fifth issue will be all about Opey's Dad.
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:icondiegotripodi:
DiegoTripodi Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2011
Cool. :) Handling a couple of projects at once I guess can make for more productivity if one balances well... there's this book called "Pulphope", which is an art-book by Paul Pope, that has an essay on working methods, where Pope wrote about working on a number of projects at once, and rotating among them, depending on his grade of interest in each one at different times.

I found it very, very interesting-- usually most texts that I have found about comics focus on either technical, or nostalgic stuff, and it's nice reading about that. This came to mind because of what you mentioned of working a week on Miss Doomsday, and the other in Opey, which reminded me of that method. I browsed quickly Pope's blog entries to see if I find it, but I think it's not there. :faint: [link] Anyways, if you have the chance to read that one, I think you'd like that text, it's very motivating. :nod:

Needless to say, looking forward to seeing your new pages!
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:iconmetakaios:
MetaKaios Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
"Respect The Cactus" must become a T-shirt, if it isn't already.

I dunno, Anne's face looks different from your usual style. Looks kinda weird.
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
It's a reference to the character by :jhames34":.

I wonder how Anne looks different than my usual style. Anyhoo, I'm thinking with going with my last version.
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:iconsharles25:
SHarles25 Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
To be honest. this is really close to the way I imagine you drawing a comic.
Plus it's an exellent idea to put the pizza on the other side making the kitty more in first plan ;)
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
I see what you're saying. Thanks.
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:iconearthmanprime:
EarthmanPrime Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
I can really see the Eisner influence in your art, it works well.

I do have to say the sexiness of Anne here is very powerful.
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Thanks, Larry. I'm thinking of going with the previous version, though. Curses. All that time wasted. Ah, well... :)
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:iconearthmanprime:
EarthmanPrime Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Well whatever you want to do Zac, you are your best champion and critic.
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:iconmetakaios:
MetaKaios Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
I can really see you in it. Gahaha.
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:iconearthmanprime:
EarthmanPrime Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
What are you referring to?
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
If you'll look over Anne's left shoulder, I put in a little reference to you. :)
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:iconearthmanprime:
EarthmanPrime Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Oh my god how did I miss that? Thanks Zac. I am glad I am no detective.
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Sure thing, Larry. You rule. :)
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:iconearthmanprime:
EarthmanPrime Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011  Hobbyist General Artist
Thanks for saying so Zac, I am a King after all, though me kingdom be very small. :D
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:iconcurtsibling:
curtsibling Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Digital Artist
Nice to see a girl relaxing!

Nice work!
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Thank you so much. I'm thinking of going with the earlier version but I do like this rendition of Anne.
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:iconyvash:
yvash Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
It's a great frame and it warrants inclusion, in my opinion. The nonchalance on Anne's face is exquisite, and gloriously juxtaposed with her cat's put-upon frown.

(Also, is dat sum Alan Moore tribute I see there?)
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Thanks! I thought about putting this drawing into the previous version of the page but, unfortunately, it wouldn't be consistent. There's a lot more posters in this drawing than in the previous version and the cat is on the reverse of where he was in the other version. Looks like I can't use this drawing.

By Alan Moore, I'm assuming you mean the long haired, psychotic-looking picture hanging on the wall. I did think of him when I finished drawing it but it was meant to be a generic, long haired psychotic-looking dude. :)
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:iconyvash:
yvash Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2011
I really think it'd be a shame to lose it. It might not work as a frame on the actual page but I see no reason not to use it as an ident for some marketing or even keep it included in the book - as a splash page illustration or on the credits page etc. It's lovely, and you're hard on yourself. Trust me, I know this from experience!
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:icondarksamuraix1999:
DarkSamuraiX1999 Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
Lovely ^^
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:iconcluedog:
cluedog Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011  Professional Traditional Artist
Thanks, Philip. :)
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:icondarksamuraix1999:
DarkSamuraiX1999 Featured By Owner Feb 13, 2011
No problem bro ^^
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